I think ram muay is an integral part of the muaythai tradition. It is an aspect of the art, I think, that helps set it apart from fightsport like mma or boxing. I think all serious students of the art should learn it and its significance. It has the subtle effect of anchoring the sport as a respectable form of martial art and not just mere pugilism. That being said, many Thais perform ram muay perfunctorily and some non-Thais have a nice ram muay and then end up fighting like chickens with their heads cut off.

While I totally respect ram muay and think you should definitely learn it and do it if you are fighting in Thailand, I think it is far from the most important aspect of muaythai and not worth arguing over. People come to see (and bet on) fights, not ram muay (this does not mean it is ok to boo during ram muay). I want to see composure, clean techniques in the Thai tradition, a demonstrated understanding of the game, and good fighting spirit. The sport is not a ruleset, as many people around the world seem to think; it has its own legacy and flavor that distinguishes it from all other types of fighting. To call fights that do not retain the Thai feel of the game, at least to some degree, “muaythai,” is wrong. I am way more interested in fights retaining the true spirit (fimeu, I guess, as the French would say) in this sense than I care about ram muay.

So, even though I have admired beautiful ram muay on several occasions, I have never found myself saying, “Gee, that fight would have been a lot better if they had done ram muay in the beginning.” I don’t think ram muay makes or breaks a fight, but I also think you should learn (if you get the chance to learn it authentically) and respect it. I certainly don’t think it should be disrespected in any way, shape or form if it done outside of Thailand. But just because you do ram muay doesn’t mean you can fight in the Thai tradition, and just because you don’t do it doesn’t me you can’t.

I believe that the Ram Muay when available should be learned and used not only as a sign of respect to your teacher but as a thank you to all fighters and that have come and gone before you and taught the art of 8 limbs – keeping it alive for centuries and making it available to you without having to go to Thailand. I have no problems with people that don’t “Ram”, nor do I think it’s necessary or disrespectful if the dont. One thing that does piss me off are some complete tools out their that will snicker or mock a fighter when he/she does the ram muay and the funny thing is that those fighters get their asses handed to them 98% of the time. I do give much more respect to those fighters who choose to learn it because it shows a deeper understanding of Muay Thai being more than just a combat sport. I also think that the Ram Muay is a beautiful and very ‘marketable’ ritual of our sport which will only help it grow in popularity across the world.

Glad I did.

I was lucky to find a place locally that stresses the marital arts aspect and cultural history.

I will definitely stop back in.
Great site!

Sure, there are muay thai techniques used in all of these fights — Pride and the UFC too.. But are you really fighting muay thai? Can you elbow to the head? Can you knee to the head? Can you do more than one strike in the clinch… ? All these modified rules makes some other form of fight entertainment that is just not real muay thai.

When I trained in Thailand I asked to be taught the Ram Muay. They obliged and showed me but now I have forgotten it all (because I was stupid and asked 2 days before I left). I wish I would have learned better and remembered it because I would do it before every fight.

Nopstar said that doing Ram Muay won’t make you a better fighter and this is correct. But fighting in a Muay Thai fight without doing the Ram Muay is like shooting a gun with rubber bullets. It looks and sounds the same, may hurt like a bitch but, it isn’t a REAL gun.

I do agree with the Prin, it would be interesting to get a “thai-trainers” take on this. Not as a be-all-end-all opinion or an endorsement of the right thing to do, but it would be really interesting to hear what thai’s (trainers and former fighters) think about foreign fighters performing or not performing the ram muay.

Nopstar, can you ask around and add to this thread?

being of thai descent, i empathize with the position that care should be taken to not strip muay thai of its cultural aspects in the name of pragmatism, as is the american way. it’s actually somewhat offensive to read opinions that come across as “that traditional stuff is useless and backwards, we’ll define muay thai however we like.”

on the other hand, being in america and not having easy access to trainers who can show me how to perform a proper ram muay, as well as not sharing certain cultural aspects you mention (like having a king), i understand why people are reluctant to make the ram muay a defining feature of the art; for people who don’t/won’t perform it, it would invalidate a lot of hard work, as far as being able to tie into a long history of successful muay thai fighters.

my muay thai teacher (who is white) says, “man, white guys just shouldn’t do the ram muay. it just comes off corny.” i can understand his point of view – having seen some non-thais perform it, i can see where some people would view it as being pretentious or something – i.e. you’re not thai, don’t speak thai, yet are adopting this one aspect of thai culture.

these issues of cultural authenticity are tough, and come up alot for many of america’s cultural imports – music, food, etc. i don’t currently do the ram muay, but for me, that’s only an issue of access; i would gladly learn it if my teachers were thai and were willing to teach it.

i wonder what thai trainers think of this – do you know?